Généalogie and Heritage

Source: Unknown d'Orléans - Medieval Lands - FMG

Description

Type	Valeur
Titre	Unknown d'Orléans - Medieval Lands - FMG

Entrées associées à cette source

Personnes
ROBERT IV 'le Fort' Comte de Paris AH01

Médias

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Notes


[sister . The possible identity of the mother of Robert "le Fort" is suggested by the charter dated 20 Feb "anno XXVII regnante domino Carolo…rege" under which "Robertus…beati Martini abbas…et comes" confirmed donations to Tour Saint-Martin made "olim…ab Odone quondam comite Aurelianensi avunculo nostro et Willelmo eius filio"[159]. The dating clause of this document suggests that it refers to Charles III "le Simple" King of the West Franks, rather than King Charles II "le Chauve", indicating that the donor was the future Robert I King of France, rather than Robert "le Fort", although this would not change the significance of the relationship described ("avunculus" could also have been used in the document in the sense of "great-uncle"). As discussed further in the document FRANCE CAPETIAN KINGS, Anatole de Barthélemy uses this document as part of his argument for identifying Guillaume Comte de Blois as the father of Robert "le Fort". However, "avunculus" in its strict sense indicates "maternal uncle" and, while the terms "patruus" (paternal uncle) and "avunculus" (maternal uncle) are frequently used interchangeably in contemporary primary source documentation, it is possible that the relationship was through a sister of the two brothers Eudes Comte d’Orléans and Guillaume Comte de Blois, who could have been the mother of Robert "le Fort". It should be emphasised that this hypothesis is speculative. Another possibility is that, assuming that the donor was the future Robert I King of France, the relationship could have been through his mother, the wife of Robert "le Fort", who could have been the niece of the brothers Eudes Comte d’Orléans and Guillaume Comte de Blois. m ---. One child]: a) [ROBERT "le Fort" ([815/30]-killed in battle Brissarthe 2 Jul 866). The question of the paternal ancestry of Robert "le Fort" is fully discussed in the document FRANCE CAPETIAN KINGS.]

[sister . The possible identity of the mother of Robert "le Fort" is suggested by the charter dated 20 Feb "anno XXVII regnante domino Carolo…rege" under which "Robertus…beati Martini abbas…et comes" confirmed donations to Tour Saint-Martin made "olim…ab Odone quondam comite Aurelianensi avunculo nostro et Willelmo eius filio"[159]. The dating clause of this document suggests that it refers to Charles III "le Simple" King of the West Franks, rather than King Charles II "le Chauve", indicating that the donor was the future Robert I King of France, rather than Robert "le Fort", although this would not change the significance of the relationship described ("avunculus" could also have been used in the document in the sense of "great-uncle"). As discussed further in the document FRANCE CAPETIAN KINGS, Anatole de Barthélemy uses this document as part of his argument for identifying Guillaume Comte de Blois as the father of Robert "le Fort". However, "avunculus" in its strict sense indicates "maternal uncle" and, while the terms "patruus" (paternal uncle) and "avunculus" (maternal uncle) are frequently used interchangeably in contemporary primary source documentation, it is possible that the relationship was through a sister of the two brothers Eudes Comte d’Orléans and Guillaume Comte de Blois, who could have been the mother of Robert "le Fort". It should be emphasised that this hypothesis is speculative. Another possibility is that, assuming that the donor was the future Robert I King of France, the relationship could have been through his mother, the wife of Robert "le Fort", who could have been the niece of the brothers Eudes Comte d’Orléans and Guillaume Comte de Blois. m ---. One child]:

a) [ROBERT "le Fort" ([815/30]-killed in battle Brissarthe 2 Jul 866). The question of the paternal ancestry of Robert "le Fort" is fully discussed in the document FRANCE CAPETIAN KINGS.]